Theory/composition advice.

[Payul]

Well, here you can see exactly the problem, wich appears if you want to write down what has been for ages a oral thing.

In a "flamenco mind" the 6/8 or 3/4 is just a repieting from the first 6 beats.
2x3,2x3=12 etc.so it is possible without an accent on the first beat.
( it is not a wals )
You could say: this falseta is counted in 3's, like a tremolo falseta
listen to the recording from the other post the youtube paco pena soleares to the tremolo at 1.45 min.

yes the tango is often a golpe there, look at the hands in this video they knock 2 3 4 on the table, 1 the accent is not nocked ( mostly)
YouTube - Fiesta gitana por tangos Camaron de la Isla 5/6

wel, your welcome it is difficult to understand, if I may give you a bit advice, try to play what you hear, not what you see on paper, you will get the feeling in time.
listen a lot to cante too, old things are more straithforward so the compas is easyer to find.

[Black Sheep]

J1111 - have a look at YouTube - Understanding Flamenco - intro to flamenco guitar-clip 01-10 You may find some answers in these short films.

[J1111]

Thanks, Id seen these videos before and they didnt make much sense- they do now though!

[Frontera]

Originally Posted by J1111

For example in solea play E for 1 2 3 then F for 4 5 6 etc? or could you focus on one chord for a full 12 beats of the rhythm cycle?

Yes, and this is common for an introduction in Solea. The E chord with a ligato is used for the first 12 beats with accents on 3,6,8.10,& 12. I like to use a golpe on the accents.

________________G______

--0-------0-------0-------
--0-------0-------0-------
--1-------1-------1-------
--2-3~2--2-3~2--2-3~2--
--2-------2-------2-------
--0-------0-------0-------

__1______2______3______

repeat for 4,5,&6 then

_________G______________

--0-------0-------
--0-------0-------
--1-------1-------
--2-3~2--2-3~2--
--2-------2-------
--0-------0-------

__7______8______

then repeat for 9 and 10

then repeat for 11 and 12

The importance is on the compas, not the chord progression or lack thereof. I think the problem is when one get interested in flamenco guitar, they are in a rush to play a composition and they never learn the basics correct. Basic strumming with simple chords to learn compas yields to struggling with high speed arpeggios void of expression and flashy picato that comes off cold. One concentrates on the technique, rather than the compas.

I have found that by recording my playing, I can play it back and clap along and find my mistakes in compas.

[Frontera]

Here is a demo so you can hear what I wrote above.

[Frontera]

Here is a basic Solea using ligato on same chord for the 12 counts.

[Frontera]

Here is a simple Solea intro ( 12 counts) all using an E chord, as discussed in my post, followed by a simple rhythm strumming the F (E 1st string open) chord 1-2-3, then a C chord 4-5-6, then back to the F (e 1st open) 7, then little finger down on 3rd fret 2nd string 8, then little finger to 4th fret 2nd string at same time as 1st finger goes to 1st fret 1st string 9, then remate 10-11-12.

Hopes this helps explain my written post.

[J1111]

Thanks that does help make things clearer, a question though...

Does each 12 beat set have to end with a remate? I know that remate is part of the structure when accompanying el cante but does it also apply in the sense that each 12 beat cycle should 'resolve itself' musically?

I heard that in those New learning vision videos... that each 12 beat cycle is like its little structure.

Are those last few beats called the remate? and is it necesarry to do it?

thanks.

[Payul]

With dance and singing they expect the remate, it is kind of a "anchor" in the compas.

With solo pieces it is ok to solve it musically as you say.
As long as you respect the form, know what you do, so know also what you do not, you can do whatever you want.
Let's say, you want to make an apreggio for a solea that last 36 beats, and you fill in beat 10 11 12 and beat 22 23 24 musically, and end the appregio with the remate on 34 35 36. It is a bit strainge, but ok.
So, to respect the form, know, you fill in the remate, so you also know where you can play a remate if you play for a dancer or a singer.

[Payul]

Here a little example, I have no recording accuipment, sorry for the quality...

Payul